MR. HEUER: May it please the Court.
MR. JAHN: Sir, do you recall whether or not there was a name affixed to that particular piece of property that we were talking about as far as the loan from the Bank of Kingston?
MR. CLINTON: No, sir, I don't.
MR. JAHN: Okay. Does lot 13 ring a bell with you, sir?
MR. CLINTON: That - it sort of rings a bell, that could have been it, where the house was.
MR. JAHN: And do you recall, sir, that there was subsequently a sale of that particular piece of property to a man by the name of Hillman Logan, do you remember that, sir?
MR. CLINTON: I do remember that.
MR. JAHN: Okay. And in connection with that particular sale, the property had been placed in either your wife's name or you and your wife's name, and it was necessary, then, for you to execute certain documents and papers in connection with that sale; is that correct?
MR. CLINTON: That could be. I don't remember the documents, but I will - it could have been the case.
MR. JAHN: All right. I want to show you, if you will, sir, what has been marked for - And Ms. Nance, I think we need some copies for defense counsel - what has been marked for identification first as Government's Exhibit 94. And I would ask you, if you would, to take a look at this, sir.
(Clinton reviews document.)
MR. JAHN: Your Honor, if we could have a second, there apparently was some confusion when copies were provided to counsel.
Have you had a chance, sir, to review the document that has been identified as Government's Exhibit 94?
MR. CLINTON: I have, sir.
MR. JAHN: Does it have a signature, sir, on there that purports to be your signature?
MR. CLINTON: It does.
MR. JAHN: Okay. Does it also have a signature on there that purports to be the signature of James McDougal?
MR. CLINTON: It does.
MR. JAHN: Okay. Let me ask you, Mr. President, is the signature on Government's Exhibit Number 94 -
MR. CLINTON: Wait, wait. It does not have a signature.
MR. JAHN: I'm sorry. It's a blank - is that one blank, then?
MR. CLINTON: Well, I can't see. It looks like there is something down there, but I can't tell, it may be Jim's.
MR. JAHN: Okay.
MR. CLINTON: And I can't see. It says "Officer/Purchaser," but I can't read it. The only signature that I see here - well, this could be James McDougal, the Bank of Kingston. It is very - it could be. I can't tell for sure because of the copying.
MR. JAHN: Okay. Well, let's just go back, then, to your signature. You can't see your signature; is that correct?
MR. CLINTON: It is partially blocked, but I can see some of it.
MR. JAHN: Okay. And then, also there is a signature that purports to be the signature of your wife; is that correct?
MR. CLINTON: That is correct.
MR. JAHN: Sir, is that your signature?
MR. CLINTON: I don't believe it is.
MR. JAHN: All right. And as far as your wife's handwriting, sir, does that appear to be your wife's handwriting?
MR. CLINTON: I don't believe it is.
MR. JAHN: Okay. I'm going to show you next Government's Exhibit 94-B, as in boy, and I would ask you, sir, if you could, to review this document.
MR. CLINTON: (Reviews document.) All right.
MR. JAHN: Have you had a chance, sir, to review that document?
(Clinton reviews document.)
MR. JAHN: And we are going to go just to the signature, Mr. President.
MR. CLINTON: All right.
MR. JAHN: If that will help speed things up.
MR. CLINTON: All right.
MR. JAHN: Okay. Once again, on the last page, sir, is there a signature that purports to be your signature on that particular document?
MR. CLINTON: Yes.
MR. JAHN: And is there a signature, sir, that purports to be your wife's signature on that document?
MR. CLINTON: Yes, yes.
MR. JAHN: And is there a signature that purports to be Mr. McDougal's on that document?
MR. CLINTON: Yes, yes.
MR. JAHN: And as far as the document itself is concerned, 94-B, sir, is the signature on that document yours?
MR. CLINTON: I don't believe it is.
MR. JAHN: All right. And as far as the handwriting that appears under the - for Ms. Clinton, sir, does it appear to be Ms. Clinton's handwriting?
MR. CLINTON: I don't think so, no.
MR. JAHN: Okay. Now, as far as the document itself or the property itself is concerned, these two documents are - can you tell us what the heading is, as far as the title of the document?
MR. CLINTON: It says "Escrow Contract."
MR. JAHN: Okay. And can you give us a date? Is there an approximate date on the contract, itself?
MR. CLINTON: December 9th, 1981.
MR. JAHN: Okay. And as far as the contracts to the property, itself, did it, in fact, cover the property that was the subject of the loan at the Bank of Kingston, or can you tell from the legal description, sir?
MR. CLINTON: Well, it says, "Tract 13 of the Whitewater Estates," and it is being sold for $27,500. I believe that it was the subject. I'm not positive, but I believe it is.
MR. JAHN: Your Honor, we would move the introduction of Government's Exhibits 94 and 94-B.
Mr. President, you have identified those particular documents, and I believe they are now in evidence. If you would, sir, I'm going to show you next what has been marked for identification only as Government's Exhibit 94-A, and would ask you, sir, if you can, can you examine Government's Exhibit 94-A?
MR. COLLINS: You mean "B," I think.
MR. CLINTON: Yes, I can. (Clinton reviews document.)
MR. JAHN: If you would, sir, the signature that's on that particular - first of all, what type of document is it as far as its heading is concerned?
MR. CLINTON: It says, "Warranty Deed."
MR. JAHN: Okay. And can you give us an approximate date that appears at the bottom of the document where it is executed?
MR. CLINTON: December 14th, 1981.
MR. JAHN: Okay. And as far as the signature that appears on that, sir, does that appear to be your true signature?
MR. CLINTON: Yes, it does.
MR. JAHN: All right. And as far as the handwriting that appears on that particular document, sir, does that appear to be your wife's true handwriting?
MR. CLINTON: It does.
MR. JAHN: Your Honor, we would move the introduction of Government's Exhibit 94-A.
Mr. President, as far as the document itself is concerned, it did, in fact, accurately reflect that you and your wife were transferring that particular piece of property to Mr. Logan; is that correct?
MR. CLINTON: That's what the document says.
MR. JAHN: All right.
MR. CLINTON: It's a Warranty Deed.
MR. JAHN: And can you explain, though, how your signature appears on the escrow, the two versions of the escrow contract that was presented to you as Government's Exhibits 94 and 94-B?
MR. CLINTON: I believe that - no, I can't explain that, that's the first time I have seen it.
MR. JAHN: All right. Have you looked - well, I believe you have been shown to it - you were shown during the course of your interrogatories, I think you were questioned about it during that time, during the course of your interrogatories, you also expressed at that time the sentiment that it was not your signature. And so, I'm asking now, if you would - that was just, what, 1994, 1995. Can you explain - do you have any recollection as to how your signature could have appeared on this particular document?
MR. CLINTON: I have no recollections about it.
MR. JAHN: Okay.
MR. CLINTON: I just - I remember that we sold the house to Mr. Logan.
MR. JAHN: Okay. Who was it that you looked to as far as the management of the sale? Did you, in fact, negotiate with Mr. Logan?
MR. CLINTON: No, I never met him.
MR. JAHN: Did your wife even negotiate with Mr. Logan?
MR. CLINTON: No.
MR. JAHN: Who did you and your wife look to, sir, as far as negotiations and the management of the sale of properties located at Whitewater Development Corporation?
MR. CLINTON: Mr. McDougal.
MR. JAHN: All right. So, as far as the particular document, then, that bears a signature that purports to be your signature, do you have an opinion, sir, as to who might have signed that particular document?
MR. CLINTON: I don't know that.
MR. JAHN: Okay. Have you ever - was it ever brought to your attention at that particular time that anyone was going to seek your permission to affix your signature to a document, a legal document?
MR. CLINTON: I just don't remember.
MR. JAHN: All right. Well, did you ever give Mr. McDougal either expressed or implied permission to affix your signature to any documents bearing - or relating to Whitewater Development Corporation business?
MR. CLINTON: I don't remember having such a discussion, but Mr. McDougal was clearly managing the property and doing what he thought that he could to move the property.
MR. JAHN: Okay.
MR. CLINTON: But I don't remember any specific discussion of that, sir.
MR. JAHN: And you entrusted Mr. McDougal, or you trusted Mr. McDougal to do what was necessary for the benefit of the joint venture between yourself and your wife; is that correct?
MR. CLINTON: I did trust him, yes, sir.
MR. JAHN: All right. And were there occasions, for instance, where Mr. McDougal would send you documents to sign, such as loan renewals and extensions, that you would sign and return to him?
MR. CLINTON: Well, I signed some renewals and extensions over time, perhaps he sent them to me. I don't remember specifically.
MR. JAHN: Well, did you ever initiate or undertake an active role in obtaining the financing for Whitewater Development Corporation, itself?
MR. CLINTON: No, sir, I did not.
MR. JAHN: All right. As far as the initial loans that Whitewater, can you explain to the jury basically how Whitewater Development Corporation was initially financed?
MR. CLINTON: Yes, sir. When we bought the 230 acres of land, we - the price was $200,000, and we paid $20,000 down, which we financed with a loan, I think from Union Bank of Little Rock, but anyway, from another bank, and then we borrowed the $180,000 amount from the local bank in Marion County, the bank in Flippin, it has had several different names over the last 15 years, I think it has had three different names, but anyway, it is the only bank in town.
MR. JAHN: Okay.
MR. CLINTON: We borrowed the money from that bank, the principal amount. And it was - and our hope, I will say again, was that we could sell enough lots so that the income from the lots would at least be sufficient to pay off the bank notes when they came due, and then hopefully, some day, we would actually make a profit.
MR. JAHN: Okay.
MR. CLINTON: It was a vain hope, as it turned out.
MR. JAHN: As far as the land itself, let's take it one step at a time, you talked about the purchase of the land. Did you and Ms. Clinton ever even go and look at the land before it was acquired, sir?
MR. CLINTON: No, sir. We saw some pictures of it, and I was very, very familiar with that county, with the White River, that's where I had run for Congress, I had lived in northwest Arkansas for three years before I moved to Little Rock, and so I was - when Jim described it to me, and I saw a couple of pictures, I knew where it was and what it was.
MR. JAHN: Okay.
MR. CLINTON: And I made the judgment it was a good business risk.
MR. JAHN: Sure. So, you, again - he showed you photographs, he described it to you, he told you what his hopes were for the property, he told you what his expectations were for the property; is that correct, sir?
MR. CLINTON: That's correct.
MR. JAHN: Okay. And did he tell you what his dreams and visions were for the property, for the area?
MR. CLINTON: Well, I was familiar with the work that he was doing, and with the fact that he had done quite well in the 1970s, as land values had escalated and retirees had flooded into our state, and it seemed like a good risk to me, because I was familiar with the experience of the last several years.
MR. JAHN: Is the answer yes, sir? Did he tell you what his dreams or visions were for this particular property?
MR. CLINTON: Well, he told me what he hoped - he told me what he hoped would happen to the business ventures.
MR. JAHN: Okay.
MR. CLINTON: And I thought it was a good risk, and so I joined him.
MR. JAHN: And you placed your trust, and your wife placed your trust in Mr. McDougal's abilities and his integrity; is that correct?
MR. CLINTON: Yes. But we also had an independent judgment about what the market would probably do. Turned out our judgment was wrong.
MR. JAHN: Now, you had a situation involving Mr. Logan's property. You indicated you got some financing at Union National Bank. Do you know who the loan officer was at Union National Bank that made that loan?
MR. CLINTON: I don't remember that, sir.
MR. JAHN: Did you ever know or meet a Harry Don Denton that worked at Union National Bank?
MR. CLINTON: I know who Don Denton was. I'm not sure I met him at that time or whether he was the loan officer on the note.
MR. JAHN: Did you have anything to do with acquiring the initial financing from Union National Bank?
MR. CLINTON: I'm not sure. I might have, because I had some friends who worked there and I knew the people who owned the bank, but I'm not sure.
MR. JAHN: As far as the major financing from the only bank in Flippin, and I'm with you, I can't keep the names straight, so let's just refer to them, to the bank in Flippin, as far as the major financing, did you have anything to do with that major financing?
MR. CLINTON: Well, I knew the people at the bank, and I was aware that they were willing to finance it, but I believe Mr. McDougal made the contact.
MR. JAHN: Okay. So, again, you were deferring to Mr. McDougal's expertise and Mr. McDougal's leadership -
MR. CLINTON: That's right.
MR. JAHN: - in terms of establishing this particular transaction?
MR. CLINTON: That's correct.
FORWARD: Cross-Examination by the Prosecutor, Ray Jahn (continued), with introduction of Exhibits 73, 87, 89 and 91